Solving the Human Element in a Fast-Paced Tech World w/ Mark Haubein
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Transcript
Step inside the strategy behind modernizing Rawlings Sporting Goods with Mark Haubein, the Senior Vice President of Information Technology, as he shares how he guides an iconic heritage brand through massive digital transformations by focusing on team empowerment and autonomy. He breaks down why up to ninety percent of all project failures stem from communication breakdowns rather than technical glitches, offering practical strategies to ensure true alignment across an organization. Listeners will walk away with his secrets for staying calm under intense pressure, the value of overcoming blind spots through feedback, and why humility is the foundational trait every impactful leader must possess.
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Credits: Host: Lisa Nichols, Executive Producer: Jenny Heal, Marketing Support: Joe Szynkowski & Dylan Price, Podcast Engineer: Portside Media
Mark Haubein
I've I've said in the past that eighty, ninety percent of all issues are usually because we had a breakdown in communication. It's not that the technology failed necessarily. It's that the communication failed. You know? And that could be that maybe a developer and a and a, you know, someone that is moving the change into production were communicating about when it should go in, or it could be, that, you were trying to understand the requirement from a person in the department and that they were they told you just one thing and you heard another and you designed a third thing. So that's really the the biggest breakdown that can take place is in communication. Lisa Nichols
It takes something a little more to lead with impact. I'm Lisa Nichols, author of Something Extra, and this podcast was inspired by our daughter, Ali, whose additional chromosome has shaped how I see people in leadership. Each episode features conversations with inspiring leaders from around the world about what truly defines how they lead and serve others. If you enjoyed today's conversation, please consider leaving a five star review. It helps more people discover the show. And if you'd like to go deeper, my book, Something Extra, is available on Amazon and through other major book retailers. Today, we are joined by Mark Hawbein, the senior vice president of information technology at Rawlings Sporting Goods. Mark is an award winning IT leader with a career built on leading major digital transformations and a master at turning heritage companies into modern tech driven powerhouses. Well, Mark Hawbine, welcome to the something extra podcast. I'm so delighted to make it work. Mark Haubein
Yeah. I'm excited to be here. Lisa Nichols
I'm excited to be here that you're here as well. You and I know each other because we're both in the tech space. Mark Haubein
That's right. We had and been bumping into each other in the the, the halls of various conferences for years. Lisa Nichols
That's right. Exactly. So I'm excited for our listeners to learn from you. Now I know that you are a Missouri boy. Right? Mark Haubein
I am, Missouri born and bred. Yes. That's true. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. Centralia? Mark Haubein
Yep. Yeah. Small town just north of Columbia. That's right. Lisa Nichols
What was growing up like for you? Were there things growing up, Mark, that kind of informed who you are today? Mark Haubein
Oh, I think for sure. I mean, certainly family and then just just the community itself. You know, with a small town, you always have sort of every you grew up with everybody, so you kinda know everybody. Mhmm. Just good and bad. That's, it it really helps form your character and and your your basic beliefs. And having a strong church community also was a big part of that. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. That's mine too. Grew up in a small town in Kentucky, and church was central and, just good values. And, Mark, here's the other thing. I couldn't get away with anything because my parents knew everyone. Mark Haubein
Yep. Yep. Yeah. If you were the one stuck in a cornfield with your with your car, you you, you knew the tow truck driver was gonna call your folks. Folks. Right? Lisa Nichols
That's exactly right. Yeah. But I look back on that, and, you know, that's good to have some degree of accountability and yeah. Mark Haubein
Well, I think a lot of times people are looking for some sort of, boundaries. Right? I know that's that's certainly the case with kids as they're growing up, and I think that helps a lot to help to find those early. Lisa Nichols
I I think so too. Yeah. I'd love some time when I get extra margin. Mark, I'd love to do a whole study on people that came from small towns. Mark Haubein
Yeah. I agree. Yeah. That would be fascinating. Lisa Nichols
I mean, how many people do you and I know personally just in our own circle, Todd Fenders? I mean, we know so many, right, that came out of small towns, and I think there's something to that. I really do. But, I had Mark Lashoff on the podcast last week, and he was a NHL player. Played for the Boston Bruins. Mark Haubein
Grew up Lisa Nichols
in a small town in, North New York and, you know, not a lot to do. His dad built an ice rink in the backyard. Mark Haubein
And look what happened. Lisa Nichols
And look what happened. He become became a national hockey, league player. So but, you know, let's let's get into what you're doing. I mean, you've been in IT leadership for thirty years. I think you started as a COBOL programmer. Mark Haubein
I did. You're right. Yeah. It's sort of an accidental IT career in a lot of ways. You know, I went to to school for business, both undergraduate and graduate degrees, and and then ended up getting recruited by Andersen Consulting at the time, which is now Accenture. And that's the first thing they did is they send you to boot camp, and you'd learn how to COBOL program. So I ended up in IT somehow because of that. Lisa Nichols
Well, it's obviously worked out okay for you because Mark Haubein
It's been pretty good. Yeah. Lisa Nichols
It's been good. What was what's been the most surprising thing on your journey? Yeah. I mean, thirty plus years, Mark. Mark Haubein
Wow. Most surprising. I I think it's it's learning to deal with how the pendulum swings back and forth. You you when we started out, it was all about, hey. We're gonna be, you know, having the mainframes, and you're gonna be programming on that. And then PCs came out and became distributed computing, and now things are starting to switch back, you know, as it goes toward cloud computing. It's watching that technology pendulum swing is just kinda fascinating and surprising. And, you know, I think the most recent surprise is how quickly AI is catching on. It's just, Lisa Nichols
Oh my goodness. Mark Haubein
Really hard to keep track of and keep up with it. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. For sure. Well, the the thing that I'm thinking as you're talking, Mark, it certainly has kept you on your toes. Mark Haubein
Absolutely. Yeah. There there's never a day that's the same as the one before. Lisa Nichols
Mhmm. Yeah. No no, no, latitude there to get bored or, you know, to stop growing. You gotta continue to grow. Right? I love that. I love that. Well, you know, how how do you think, like because you've worked for some, like you said, Accenture, Anderson, now Accenture, Anheuser Busch, By John. Now you're at Rawlings. Mhmm. You know, how do you think I mean, because you I'm sure you are not the leader today that you were when you started thirty years ago. Mark Haubein
Right. Lisa Nichols
You know, what have been some of those things along the way, Mark, that have really shaped you as a leader? Mark Haubein
Yeah. You know, I think one of the big things, Lisa, is humility. I don't know that I was really all that good at that when I first came into the job force. Yeah. You know, because you're kinda taught when you're in school to to strive for excellence and do all that type of thing. And and then you get into the workforce, and and you quickly learn that it's not all about you. It's about everybody around you and working as a team. And, that that took a few lessons along the way, but I think, certainly, that's one of the one of the ones I learned as as life went along. Mhmm. Lisa Nichols
Has there been a common thread with all of those companies that you've worked for? I mean, I guess, yeah, I could surmise some things. You know? Mark, one of the things is people. Mark Haubein
Yeah. It's it's really all about people. One of the things that sure. One of the things I've learned is I like to build teams. So as long as I'm in an environment where I'm given sort of a latitude to do that, I usually can can do well. And and that's what I love to do is build the teams up and and get people working together and delivering things for the company. I mean, that that's really where the the value is Lisa Nichols
at. Mhmm. Right. Yeah. How have you because, again, we've been at thirty years. I mean, maybe when you and I first started, Mark, it could have been more the command and control type leadership. How have you seen it evolve? Because I certainly have. I've seen leadership evolve in the many years that I Mark Haubein
Of course. I grew up in the partner, type of situation with Anderson, and that was definitely kind of a command and control situation. You know? You listen to the partner, they gave you direction, and you went ahead. And I think that's definitely changed over the years because it's become much more of an empowerment situation. You still have someone that that's there to bounce decisions off of, but teams are starting to work much more and more autonomously every day. And I think we're even seeing that, you know, inside and outside of IT with you know, I mentioned AI earlier. That's creating sort of an autonomy that people haven't had. They have the ability to create their own agents and, you know, deploy those and have those help them with their productivity and their teams. So, I think that's been a real dramatic sea change that we're seeing over time. Lisa Nichols
Mhmm. I think people enjoy that a lot more. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Most people do. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. It engages their minds and their hearts and their hands. And I think about I think about Daniel Pink. I don't know if you ever read his book Drive or not, but that's one of the things, you know, that Daniel talks about there is people want autonomy in what they're doing. So, yeah, that's that's really good. Okay. So I know that you are super I mean, people have said you're very detailed oriented, but then you are you're also described as a people oriented leader, Mark. So how do you balance performance driven with people focused? Mark Haubein
You know, I think it's interesting to use performance and detailed, and those aren't always the same thing. Mhmm. So for me, it's about listening to people and sitting down and building that relationship over time and making sure you understand where where they're trying to go, both from a career standpoint and a project standpoint, whatever it is they're working on. And then just balancing those against the needs of the the company and where we're trying to take us. You know? How how do the how does their career path align? And if it doesn't, that's okay because you're building leaders for for themselves, for them to go out and, you know, perform better where they can can be the best deployed. Mhmm. You know? And many people that have that have left the fold as it were and gone out and been successful, you know, whether that's to become an entrepreneur, you know, with their own firm, like like you and Greg have done, or whether that's to go into a, you know, a small company or a large company, whatever it might be that they can thrive at. I think that's that's the biggest reward for me is seeing. Lisa Nichols
I love that. I love that you said that, Mark. I'll never forget having Jim Swanson, and you remember Jim Swanson, the global CIO for Bear. I'll never forget him saying this. He said, you know, I wanna train people really, where they can go, and they have the skills to go anywhere. Now I wanna build a culture where they don't wanna go. Right. But I love what you just said. The reward is building the people and regardless if they stay with the company or not. Right? And, there's an impact there. There's definitely an impact. Well Yeah. Now you're the SVP at Rawlings. Mark Haubein
Mhmm. Lisa Nichols
Rawlings is definitely an iconic brand. You know, we see it on our bats. We see it on our bulls, all of that. You know, it was founded in eighteen eighty seven. Can you tell Just a bit ago. Yeah. Just a little bit ago. I mean, that is really that's really remarkable. What? That's a hundred and forty, almost a hundred and fifty years? Mark Haubein
Yeah. Mhmm. Lisa Nichols
That's you tell us a little bit, our listeners, a little bit of the history of Rawlings. Mark Haubein
Wow. So, I mean, Rawlings started off, you know, as as really just trying to to make baseball gloves and then all kinds of other different types of products. If you if you come into, what we call our Rawlings experience store here out at Westport, near our headquarters, you'll see all the different types of things that we used to make, everything from golf clubs to boxing glove gloves. I mean, it's just it's all over the all over the map. You know, it was about being involved in athletics. And I think over time, things have shifted. Certainly, you know, the late fifties when the Gold Glove Award was was started, that was a big iconic moment for us. And and now we have an even bigger Gold Glove up on the roof of the building here that, that has allowed us to hate say, hey. Yeah. We are here in Saint Louis. I don't know how many people I've talked to who said, oh, I didn't realize Rawlings was in Saint Louis. I had the same reaction when I was recruited. I didn't realize it either, but, you know, it's been around since the late eighteen hundreds, so it's kind of crazy. But, yeah, it's it's been an interesting evolution. And Rawlins has changed a lot over the last probably five to ten years as well as we've had a chance to, you know, really focus on what we call diamond sports, so softball and baseball. And it kinda shed some of the other items in the portfolio, and that's really created a sort of a surge in in, in people's demand for the product and in our interest in in continuing to provide them with the best products we can. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. I was thinking you're you're you're narrowing it down, but it's becoming more excellent and Mhmm. Very, what I wanna say, almost like cut it's there's some customization too Yeah. Other apps. With your products. Right? Mark Haubein
Yeah. In fact, we just introduced a, a new three d glove builder out on our website. So you can actually go out and not only customize your glove, but you can see it as it as you spin it and turn it and look at it at all angles, to see what it's really gonna look like when you get it delivered. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. That's innovative. That's innovative. Well, let me ask you this. What has been your mission since stepping into the role? Like, tell me about what kinds of things you guys have done and Mark Haubein
Sure. Yeah. Well, the biggest thing that we had to take on initially was, the ERP project. So we had an old green screen a s four hundred based system that had been around for, I think, twenty three years when we finally replaced it. We replaced it with a a newer version of the same product, so it was somewhat familiar. So it wasn't as big a change as it could have been. But from a, a user experience, it was dramatically different. Right? Because now you're logging into a web browser instead of, you know, having your function keys that you're using on a daily basis. And so that was a really big deal, and that took us until, summer of twenty twenty four when we finally brought that live. So that that was the big initial push. But in addition to that, you know, I mentioned earlier that I like to build teams. And that was the a big, sort of, piece of why I was brought on board was we knew we needed to build up the IT department, to the point where we could really deliver more projects for the company, because there was a lot of challenges that were ahead of us. You know, whether that's, you know, mergers and acquisitions or trying to get new products off the ground, we had to have a much more resilient and agile architecture that we could really move forward with. And Mhmm. In order to do that, we needed the people in place to make that happen. And and we've been able to build the team up to to do that and partnered with all of our other departments to make sure that, we're doing what they think should be done, and, you know, that's really what it's all about. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. No. That's good. We could probably do a whole podcast just on that. Probably could. A collaboration that has to happen and prioritization of projects and, you know, there's a lot there. Mark Haubein
Yeah. There never seem to be an end to the number of ideas that, the creative people around us can can come up with. Right? Lisa Nichols
Exactly. So why don't you talk about that process? So you've got all these different people in the organization thinking that we should do this and this and this. I mean, how what what's the process that you go through, Mark, in prioritization? Mark Haubein
Yeah. And we've been introducing a lot of that. One of the things that we put in place is a a PMO to help with that process to sort of make sure that intake process is is funneled correctly. You know, I think in the past, it was a little bit more wild west. You know, whoever could could come up with a good idea, you'd move forward with it, but then you didn't necessarily know what the impact was on other initiatives that were already in flight. So now that we've got that process in place, we're getting a lot better at understanding that and sitting down and going, not only what is the budget, do we have the money, but and what how long is it gonna take, but what are the resources really that are gonna be necessary to deliver it? Because it's not about, you know, hey. I'm gonna need three programmers and and two business analysts and that type of thing. It's really more about, okay. Who are those people from the other departments that we're gonna need to pull in so that we can order the project because they may already be decked against two or three things that are part of their real job instead of this project that we're trying to get off the ground. So Mhmm. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. And everything comes at a cost to something else. Right? Mark Haubein
It really does. Yeah. So Time is time is limited. That's that's that's for sure. It's one of the biggest constraints we've got. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. For sure. Well, the one thing that we can say about technology is it's gonna change. And the rate of change. Right? It just seems like we're on this this train that's just going so fast. So Mark Haubein
Yeah. Lisa Nichols
Mark your opinion. Every year. Exactly. And especially, like you already said, with AI, we don't even know what that's going to to do, right, and how quickly we're gonna move. But, you know, you we've already talked about, you know, that you've been described at this people oriented leader. How do you bring people along when that rate of change is so fast? I mean and that can be from a skilling issue. That can also be from just an adopting change. It's hard. Mark Haubein
Yeah. It really is. And and, you know, I think within my own department, I can do the things that I need to do from a development plan standpoint, and I can work with people to make sure they're getting the right training or that they're getting exposed to the new skill sets and those types of things. But the real challenge is how do we drive change across the company, and not not really IT driving it, but us as an organization. How do we drive change as Rawlings? And and that's that's where it really gets hard because, you know, people get used to doing things a certain way and, convincing them to do things a different way is sometimes a little little bit of a struggle. But I think it's it's just a matter of sitting down and understanding how people work and making sure to you can explain to them how this could be better and then kinda getting their, their buy in for that. A lot of times, the the biggest champions you can have are the people that were the hardest to convince. Lisa Nichols
Oh, that's a good point. That's a good point. But if you can get them to understand the impact, if you can get them to understand the return Mark Haubein
Right. Lisa Nichols
That you're gonna get, I mean, then they'll get on board and Mark Haubein
Absolutely. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. That's so good. I already know the question to this, but I wanna ask you. I mean, how what is, communication? What role does that have to play in the successful rollouts? And Mark Haubein
It's not important at all. Lisa Nichols
It's not important right now. Just Mark Haubein
It's probably the most important thing that we do. Lisa Nichols
Yes. Mark Haubein
I mean, the the technology side can be a challenge, but it's it's not the biggest challenge. The biggest challenge is always the people side of the equation. Mhmm. And that's and the biggest part of that is communication. I've I've said in the past that eighty, ninety percent of all issues are usually because we had a breakdown in communication. It's not that the technology failed necessarily. It's that the communication failed. You know? And that could be that maybe a developer and a and a, you know, someone that is moving the change into production were communicating about when it should go in, or it could be, that you were trying to understand the requirement from a Yes. Person in the department and that they were they told you just one thing and you heard another and you designed a third thing. So Lisa Nichols
Yes. Mark Haubein
That's really the the biggest breakdown that can take place is in communication. Lisa Nichols
You know, Mark, it's so funny because I was just sitting thinking about this yesterday, and I and I was thinking, I think communication is the one thing that really covers a span of a lot of things. That can be in your family. That can be with a friendship. That can be IT. I mean, really, the communication. And I don't know who said this, but I've always loved this quote. Just because you think communication happened doesn't mean that it actually did. You know, there just may have been a transmission Mark Haubein
Yeah. Lisa Nichols
Of information, but it doesn't mean communication happened. Mark Haubein
Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I totally agree. One of my favorite quotes is, I think this is from, seven habits by Stephen Covey, and it's seek first to understand and then to be understood. Lisa Nichols
Yes. Mark Haubein
And I see far too often that we're trying to jump into a conversation because we were we're in solution mode. That's really prevalent in IT because that's what we do. Lisa Nichols
We Mark Haubein
provide solutions. So it's really easy to get into the habit when you're having that conversation with someone to say, oh, okay. I think I know what you wanna do. Well, wait a few minutes and make sure that you understand what what they're really trying to do and keep asking those questions to peel the onion back on the why they wanna do things. Because then you'll soon soon discover the real cause and the real reason, and then you can go forward. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. So good. So good. Alright. I'm gonna ask you one more question, then we do need to take a quick break. But Mark Haubein
Okay. Lisa Nichols
You you talk about I always say every organization has a culture. Yep. My friend Mark Miller says either you design it or it happens by accident. You'd rather design it. Right? Mark Haubein
Yeah. Lisa Nichols
But I've also said that IT, your department has a culture. And as a leader in IT, you want to have a good culture where you're a talent magnet. So I know that you have said, I have read that you you want the IT organization at Rawlings to be a can do culture. Can you dig into that a little bit? What does that actually look like in practice? Mark Haubein
Yeah. I think it's it's a matter of, again, back to listening and understanding what people are trying to get done. You know, it's not just agreeing and saying yes. It's saying, I think we can do that, but let's talk about how we get there. Because sometimes someone will come to you with a solution, and that may not be the right solution for the the the, problem. It's really better to figure out what the problem is and then say, yeah. We can do this. And then making sure that people understand to to have that attitude with if somebody does come forward with a request, I think we can probably help you, but let's talk about how. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. No. That's really good. Mark, you and I both know Christy Barker Mark Haubein
Yep. Lisa Nichols
With Owen. Very well. And I'll never forget her saying one time, one of the first questions that she asked out the gate is what is the problem we're trying to solve? Mark Haubein
Yep. That's a good that's a good line to have right there. Love it. Lisa Nichols
And just getting clarity on that at the get go? Because if you don't get clarity, you may be trying to solve a problem that really doesn't matter. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Making assumptions is the biggest biggest problem. And a lot lot of times, that's one of the biggest breakdowns in communication too is you've made an assumption about what someone's what someone needs or what they're trying to do or what even the question is that they're asking. Lisa Nichols
Yes. Mark Haubein
If you don't ask those questions, it's real hard to get down to the root of. Lisa Nichols
Of. Yes. Very good. Well, we do need to take a quick break, and we'll be right back with Mark on the Something Extra podcast. AD
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Welcome back, everyone, to the Something Extra podcast with my friend, Mark. Mark, this has been so good. Thank you so much again for just sharing your wisdom. I know it's gonna help our listeners. But I wanted to let's talk about decision making and executive presence. It's been said of you that you stay calm under pressure. Mark Haubein
Most of the time, I'd say that's true. Lisa Nichols
How do you do that? What is your what's your secret? What's your mojo as far as, staying calm under pressure? Mark Haubein
That's that's really interesting. I'm not sure how to quite answer it. I'd say it's just a matter of of if you're struggling to figure out what to say, don't say anything. At first, learn what the problem is and listen. So that's a part of it. I think another part of it is that if everybody else is panicking, there's no reason for you to add to that. So if you're better off just sitting back and saying, okay. What's the real problem? How do we solve it? And how do we move forward? Lisa Nichols
Yeah. What about this, Mark? Because as I'm asking myself that question, I'm thinking, no. I don't always stay calm under pressure either, but, I try. And what I always go back to is, gosh, we got through that. We got through that hard season. We got through that hard season. We'll get through this one. Mark Haubein
And Absolutely. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. I think relying on how things have gone in the past helps. Right? Oh, Mark Haubein
I think it really does. You know? And and I talk to to my teams a lot about that type of thing, Lisa, is I think it's important to to know where you're at on the journey and to look back every once in a while. Mhmm. Because if you're in the heat of it, it's really easy to get frustrated and say, we're just not making any progress. But if you take that step back and take a few minutes to just catch your breath and look back, you can go, okay. We really have made a lot of progress. Yeah. Yeah. We still got some some mountains to climb, but but we're getting there, and we'll get there one step at a time. And usually, that that helps take care of that. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. I agree. And the other word of wisdom that I would give to leaders is when you have newer people on the team Mhmm. Mark, sometimes they don't have that tribal knowledge. They don't have that history. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Lisa Nichols
So being able to tell those stories, I think, is helpful too to newer people and to say, you know, we've been here before. We've seen this before. Let me tell you what happened in whatever, you know, five years ago. Mark Haubein
Well, I think that's one of the the big pluses of some of the the groups that we join here in Saint Louis area too. You know? And you and I are involved in several of those. You know? I encourage the people on my team to do those types of things as well because those war stories that you hear from other places, other companies, you're gonna go, okay. Somebody else has dealt with this. I know they came out of it. We should be able to come out of it too. Mhmm. And then you can share your your experiences with others as well, and then they have the same kind of feedback. It's like, oh, okay. You guys went through that. Okay. Well, we should be able to make it. What would you have any suggestions? And then you can kinda share those things back and forth. And, you know, as you bring in new people and you bring in, you know, experienced tires, they have those stories to share. And then like you said, if you've got some some newer people that maybe are fairly, early on in their careers, you can try to impart, some of those stories to them also. Storytelling is a really, a big part of of what we do, I think, especially once you get into leadership positions. It's not just about trying to get things done. It's trying to make sure that people understand the history and and, what's possible. You know? You talk hear people talk about the art of the possible. Well, a lot of that wouldn't be possible if if somebody hadn't already paved the way. Lisa Nichols
So learning about that really helped. Yeah. And I'm so glad you brought up one other thing you've said about these groups. I said, don't don't ever feel like you have to go these things alone either. If you don't have a group, get into a group. If you're here in Saint Louis or even if you're not, talk to Mark and I because we can get you plugged into CIO. We can get you plugged into HMG, Mark Haubein
the Lisa Nichols
CIO, group there. There's all kinds of ways that you can get into a room with other people who've maybe gone through what you are going through. Mark Haubein
And I think you hit on another another thing within that, answer, Lisa, and that's you don't have to go alone through things. And it's not just about outside the company, you know, reaching out. It's even within. So Yes. You know, a lot of IT people are very focused on solutions like we talked about earlier, but also, wanting to be the expert and wanting to be the person that solves it and not wanting to ask for help. You know? Oh, I if I just work on this for another fifteen or twenty minutes, I can figure this out. K? If you've already worked on something for thirty minutes, you probably should go, okay. Let me talk to some of the other people on the team and see if they run into this before. They may already have the solution that you just spent thirty minutes beating your head against them and try to solve. Or they may have an idea that you can work together and then collaborate to get that problem solved. Lisa Nichols
So good. So good. Well, let me ask you this. When you've got tough decisions to make and there's no clear answer, what's your process? What's the process that you go through, Mark? Mark Haubein
Well, I think a lot. You know, you you write everything down, and you if that's, you know, sitting in a room or a war room with people to to figure things out and putting things up on a board, that's part of it. I think there's also a lot of internal, conversation that goes on for me myself. You know? There's a lot of prayer that's involved there, and then just trying to to find that peace and that calm center in whatever storm you're dealing with, then you usually can figure it out. If you if you sit down with enough smart people, they can help you get there. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. I'm so glad that you brought up something because I know faith is important to you. It's important to me too. How how does faith show up for you, Mark, like, in your living? Mark Haubein
Sure. I think it's pretty much on a daily basis. You know? As I mentioned earlier, people are the are the hardest thing to deal with. Technology is easy. So having the the faith to to say, give me give me patience, give me peace, give me understanding, whatever it might be. I think those are are really important conversations, to have, with whatever your your brand of faith might be, and that can usually help center you and keep you calm. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. Yeah. That's, I I would say that's probably one of the big reasons you're able to stay calm under pressure. Mark Haubein
Mhmm. I would agree. Lisa Nichols
Because you know you're not alone, and you know that you've got a higher power that helps you to do that. Right? Mark Haubein
Yep. Mhmm. Lisa Nichols
So good. Alright. How do you personally keep your team aligned to the bigger picture? And I'm kinda going back to Mark Haubein
Sure. Lisa Nichols
Let's borrow from Simon. Right? Cousin Simon. You know? Start with why. You know? People want to see the bigger picture. They need to understand how what they are doing, why it matters, how it maps to the bigger picture. What do you personally do to keep people aligned to the bigger picture? Mark Haubein
Yeah. I think it's it's really important to have as much transparency as you can, within a role within a leadership role like this. So I have a kind of a stair step approach to to communication around that. You know, I'm involved with exec team meetings and and whatever other, you know, leadership things that I get pulled into. But then being able to share what is not confidential, from those meetings with my team my, direct reports, but then also the the department as it's appropriate, I think is important. So that gives them a chance to hear what's happening, you know, at the broader level and and then talking to them about how what they're doing fits in. One of the things we do here at Rawlings that I've seen other companies do as well is trying to do that sort of cascading, goal setting. So you make sure you set the goals at the corporate level, and then those goals cascade down, through everybody. And and then you try to tie those goals together so that you can see how what you're doing is leading to, you know, better earnings or better sales or or better processes that might be out there. Mhmm. Lisa Nichols
How about customer sat? I mean, do you guys, measure your customer satisfaction? Do you have those? Yeah. Mark Haubein
We do. I I would say it's probably not as objective as some other places. It's somewhat subjective. Right. Certainly from a from an IT standpoint, from a from an overall company standpoint. Obviously, we do, you know, measure customer satisfaction and things like that. We try to keep that as high as possible. But, I think it a lot of it is trying to make sure that you're touching base with, other leaders or peers within the company, to make sure that that things are going smoothly. And if they're not, you know, try to address those as quickly as you can. Lisa Nichols
Right. Mark, how do you personally get feedback? Do you guys do, like, three sixties or anything like that? Do you? Okay. Mark Haubein
Yeah. I I I started that many, many years ago. Okay. Probably with two or three companies back. I try to do at least a level up, peers to the side and level below if if people have direct reports, just so you can kinda get a pattern. You know, if if you get a one off on on some of those, it's like, okay. Well, I might mention that, but maybe that doesn't get written formally into a review. But if you have a couple of people that say something similar, well, now you've got a pattern that you can see developing, and then you can try to address it. Mhmm. One of the biggest, I would say failures that we do a lot of times within review processes is people, you know, are afraid to say something to a person they're reviewing that especially if it's negative. Lisa Nichols
Yes. Mark Haubein
And I think that's just such a disservice, not to bring those up as soon as you find out because you don't want surprises, and you wanna give people a chance to, you know, turn a corner and change what they're doing. And, you know, that's been some of the the the most rewarding, things that I've seen is when you I've been able to give feedback, whether it's from me or from other people. Along those lines, it's constructive, and people go, wow. I didn't realize I was doing that, or I didn't realize what I was doing was perceived that way, which is really important. You know, perceptions are reality. One of my former leaders told me a long time ago, and I'm like, that makes a lot of sense. Yeah. So if you can see them, you know, kind of absorb that and internalize it and then make changes, and that that's just a huge, huge moment there. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. Well and it's hard. I mean, I was just I had a leader on, the podcast recently, Mark, and we're just talking about blind spots. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Lisa Nichols
And people may not believe they we all have them. Right? And self awareness is so important. I mean, there's been studies out there that that say that eighty five percent of people believe they're self aware, but the studies show that only ten to fifteen percent really are. Mark Haubein
That sounds about right. Lisa Nichols
So, you know, I mean, it's nothing to be ashamed of. I mean, we all have them, and it's hard to see yourself. And so, yeah, I always say and it's hard. It's not fun to deliver, like but you can do it in a way that still maintains that person's dignity, I believe. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Absolutely. Lisa Nichols
And it and I do believe if you really care about that person, you're not gonna want them to stay where they are. Mark Haubein
Yeah. You're gonna want them to fix it. Grow and move, so you gotta be able to give them direction. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. For sure. Mark Haubein
You gotta be able to receive it too. That's another hard part of it is. It's not just delivery. It's being able to receive feedback. So Lisa Nichols
Absolutely. Absolutely. And that requires humility. That requires, you know, courage, I think, to be able to to accept it and receive it. Mhmm. Yep. Mark Haubein
Well, that's that's one of the things about your your book that I love the most, Lisa, was that the whole first chapter was about humility. Lisa Nichols
Yes. It starts with that. Mark Haubein
I'm I'm gonna love this book because it's right up right up my alley. So Lisa Nichols
Yeah. Thank you so much for reading the book, and, you've given me such wonderful encouragement, Mark, and it means the world to me. But let's talk about personal on the personal side. So you've built this incredible career, incredible career. You have a wife, Suzanne, three kids, Kayla and Sienna and Luke. Mhmm. How have you balanced your career with your family life? And Mark Haubein
tell me. And I think you'll know. I mean, it's it's it's a challenge. Right? Yes. Yeah. I think it's making sure that they know they're important, but then also showing it by your actions. So, you know, it working till eight o'clock at night is probably not gonna help with that. So I think you're better off, you know, work until a normal time, five or six o'clock, whatever that is for your your schedule, and then you head home. And then you try to, you know, decompress on the way home so that you could be present for your family when you get there. And if you have to pick up, you know, your laptop for, you know, a half an hour in the evening and answer those four emails that you couldn't get to during the day, then that's something you've gotta do. But, for the most part, I think it's it's really about making sure that you balance the time and you balance the quality of the time even more Lisa Nichols
so. Mhmm. So setting boundaries. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Setting boundaries, and then being present, I think, is a lot of it. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. Yeah. That's so good. Well, I always say my kids, my children have been, like, one of my biggest classrooms. Mark Haubein
Absolutely. Lisa Nichols
And I have adult children now, Mark. They're still teaching me things. I'm still, like, having to grow because, you know, parenting an adult child is very different than parenting a three year old. Right? Mark Haubein
It is. Mhmm. So It's a lot more fun in some respects. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. I'm still learning, though. I'm a work in progress. Thank goodness. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Lisa Nichols
I had a friend tell me recently said, you know, really, when your kids become adults, you move more not just a coach. You move into consultant role. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Lisa Nichols
And I thought that was so good, Mark, because what is a consultant? A consultant is hired. Yeah. So you don't speak until you're hired. Mark Haubein
That's a good point, Lisa. That's a very good point. Lisa Nichols
I know. I've just I've never forgotten that. I just thought that was so good. But what have your kids taught you about leadership? Mark Haubein
I think one of the big things is right along those lines is when to step in and when not to. Sometimes you have to take a step back and let people work things out. I can still remember a time when my girls, who are only about eight seventeen months apart, They were having a little, tiff, you know, and they were probably, I don't know, ten or twelve, something like that. Mhmm. And, you know, I I I was an only child growing up, so I'm not used to all that that sibling back and forth Yes. And the the stuff that goes into that. So I I came up to the room and I said, hey. Is there anything I can do? Like, dad, we got this. You go away. I'm like, okay. And and they did. You know? They worked it out. Lisa Nichols
It out. But, Mark Haubein
you know, I think being able to apply that, I think, even at work is important too. You know, if you've got two people that are are kind of, you know, butting heads a little bit, it's okay to step in and say, hey. Why don't you guys take a break and then come back together and talk? But letting them work it out first is usually a good solution. Mhmm. Or letting things play out even in a meeting. You know, if it's a a meeting with my leadership team and things are starting to get a little bit, you know, more heated than usual. Maybe it's a topic that everybody's really passionate about. It's okay to sit back and and let the the sparks fly for a little bit until things start to work their way out and then say, okay. It seems seems like you guys have come up to, you know, a pretty good solution. Let's move forward. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. That's good. Well, let me ask you one more question, then I've got a little lightning round for you, and then we'll talk about something extra. But does your family do you guys have any rituals or practices that you do as a family, Mark, to keep you grounded, to keep you connected to one another? Mark Haubein
Yep. Yeah. One of the things that I I I love, and this is really more of a as the kids have gotten older thing is, when our oldest went off to college, Sienna, the first time, we we made a deal before she left, and that's at least once a week we were gonna connect. So pretty much it's usually Sundays, sometime in the afternoon or evening, and we all have a what we call a FAMNET call, where everybody gets on. And, you know, that's continued. So it's been, at least eight years now that we've been doing that. Lisa Nichols
That's awesome. Mark Haubein
Yeah. And it it's really fantastic because it's fun for us not only to just kinda check-in and see how things are going, but also, you know, sometimes my wife and I will just sit back and watch the kids have a conversation as opposed to us saying, hey. Well, what did you do? How are things going? You know? Sometimes it's fun just to have them, you know, go off about the latest Marvel movie or whatever the case may be. Lisa Nichols
That's so cool. Well, here's what I say about that. It's intentional, Mark. You know? I mean, it's intentional. I mean, just like we talked about building cultures. You've got a culture. You're either doing it by accident or by design. That's by design with your family to keep your family connected. And I Yeah. Mark Haubein
I think some of the benefits we found might have been accidental, but the intention of trying to stay connected was definitely there. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. I love it. Little lightning round for you. Do you have a morning routine? Mark Haubein
Absolutely. Lisa Nichols
Can you tell me? Mark Haubein
Oh, you wanna know what it is. Yeah. I get up about the same time every morning, and the first thing you do is you feed the animals. Rabbit and the dog, and then I get to feed myself. I'm a a slow up to speed person in the morning. I wanna have that gradual ramp up. So I'll I'll do that, and I'll, you know, do a little bible study and eat my cereal and then finally eventually get upstairs and take my shower and get off to work. So Mhmm. It might be an hour and a half, two hours before I get out of the house, as opposed to my wife who's usually, you know, fifteen minutes before she needs to leave. That's when she gets up and and it's all goodness. Oh my goodness. One of those. She she values, values her sleep. So Lisa Nichols
Yeah. Yeah. I'm liking it. Mark Haubein
Works. Everybody's got their own routine. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. Everybody's got their own routine. What's your favorite way to learn and to grow? Mark Haubein
I think probably more experientially than anything else. I'm more likely to wanna to to touch things or read them. Read about it, then I I don't do as well if if somebody's, trying to teach me from by just by speaking to me. Mhmm. Because it doesn't necessarily sink in. But if I can see it and touch it, then I can use k. Okay. Lisa Nichols
So books, you do odd you don't do audibles? You like Mark Haubein
reading physical books? Books. Yeah. I usually have at least one book on my desk that I'm reading that's, you know, for fun, and then there's at least two or three somewhere over there that I'm working my way through at some time for work. So Lisa Nichols
I gotcha. So besides the something extra book being your one of your favorites, what what are you reading right now that you would, recommend to our listeners? Mark Haubein
So I just finished, one of Brene Brown's books this year called Dare to Lead. Lisa Nichols
Yes. Mark Haubein
I'd recommend that one strongly. It aligns really closely with, what you've written about. You know, I think the, one of the big themes that she had was around vulnerability and how that is a, a very underutilized trait and but it should be utilized even more within leaders, because I think that brings people credibility that you can't otherwise have. It's a lot it's a lot about that same relationship building we were talking about earlier. You know, the more that you learn about someone, you know, whether that's family life or what they like to do or, you know, how they wanna have their career progress. All that stuff goes together, and then you can then share those stories. Here's what I run into you because a lot of times, the way people react at work is due to something that's happening outside of work. Lisa Nichols
Oh my goodness. I could not agree more. I was just talking to someone else about that, Mark. It's so true. And you're sitting there thinking it's about you, and it's really they've got something totally different that they're dealing with. Maybe a sick sick parent or a, you know, a child that's struggling or what and it's just good to to know those things, and you can then you you're I think you're more empathic. I think, it's it goes back to Covey, seek to understand. Mark Haubein
Yep. Seek to understand. Lisa Nichols
Right? So, what let me ask you this. Do you have a favorite way to reenergize? Mark Haubein
Downtime alone. Lisa Nichols
Downtime alone. Yep. Mark Haubein
Yeah. Yeah. You know, I think we've all done, you know, Myers Briggs and introvert, extrovert, and all that kind of stuff. And what I thought was really fascinating about all that is, you know, my classic understanding was an extrovert is someone who liked people, and and an introvert is someone who didn't wanna be around people. Well, I'm an introvert, but I love being around people, but it also drains my energy. Yeah. So if I need to recharge, I need to go read a book or go walk around in the woods or whatever the case may be. Mhmm. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. Very good. You and I share something else besides being in technology. We're I'm an only child too, Mark. Mark Haubein
Oh, there you go. Lisa Nichols
I'm an only child. I always wanted a big brother. I would tell my parents all the time. I really want a big brother. You know? But, but, that that didn't happen for me. But, yeah, we're we're both only kids. Alright. I ask every leader this. What is it something extra, Mark, that you believe every leader needs? Mark Haubein
Well, it's something that we've touched on a couple of times already, Lisa, and that's humility. I think that's it's it's critical. You know, if you don't have that, I think it's really hard to have credibility with your folks. I think it's hard to inspire them to proof or form. It's hard to empower people. So to me, that's that's that's the most important piece. Lisa Nichols
Yeah. I I I agree. That's why it's the first chapter in my book, something that expresses humility. Alright. Well, thank you so much, Mark. This has been so good. I just know that your story is gonna help our listeners, and that's the whole objective here is to help other people on their journey. So thank you for sharing your the opportunity, Lisa. Mark Haubein
I really appreciate it. Lisa Nichols
Absolutely. Absolutely. Announcer
Something extra with Lisa Nichols is a Technology Partners production. Copyright Technology Partners Inc twenty nineteen. To learn more about this week's guest, check out the show notes at tpi dot c o slash podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, consider leaving us a review. Thank you for listening to Something Extra. 
